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BullMon Nov-11-13 06:42 PM
Member since Sep 03rd 2009
19 posts
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"OIL circulation, oil change, and other questions about the oil."


          

First off, allow me to introduce myself. I am, beyond doubt,
the 'newest' of the 'newbies' to ever hit this site. No strong
bike background, with *NO* Norton background. Simply fell in
love with this 1973 850 Commando and don't know Jack about it.
Having just bought it, want to change the oil. Trying to
learn, though, and I've glad to be reading. Going over the
English manual reminds me of the old saying about England and
the USA being "Two countries divided by a single
language!" Seems cumbersome to find stuff out, little
bits of info covering the oil ciculation scattered throughout
the entire damned manual. Here goes, and again, sorry for the
multiple questions.

CHANGING THE OIL: (one combined question?)
1.) I see the drain plug in the oil tank.
2.) the large bolt head attached to the rear of said tank
supposedly has a filter within?
3.) there's a quick closing valve added to the oil feed line
as it heads to the crankcase on the right hand side (obviously
should be openned to allow drainage)
4.) is there ANOTHER filter where the oil feed line is bolted
to the crankcase?
5.) how do I drain oil from that right case?
6.) I see what appears to be a drain plug on the lower LEFT
'case.

presumably, that is ALL I need focus on when I change the oil?
And I really want to change it so I can ride a bit before the
snow flies, so greatly appreciate your responces).

QUESTION TWO:

Now... I keep reading about the more 'normal' screw on oil
filters of the 850cc... but I do not have that on my bike!
What's up with that? Anyway, can I ADD ON a base plate (forget
the name) that accepts oil feed INTO and also OUT of, which a
spin on oil filter can THEN BE ATTACHED (I saw one on ebay a
while ago)?? And, if this is so (I hope it is), would anyone
have a digital PICTURE of their's so that I can view/copy?

QUESTION THREE:

I've seen Norton Commando's that had an OIL COOLER added
(mounted on the frame just aft of the front wheel, where
modern water coolers sit). Where would I get one, and where's
the best place to buy one?

Anyway... I know it sounds rediculous to be so new I'm asking
about how to change the friggin oil without making a mistake!
It's just all new to me. I've wrenched (a lot!) on old English
CARS before, just never a Norton. Truly don't want to screw
this up.

Oh, yes:  I mentioned that there's a quick close valve added
into the main oil feed line from the tank to the 'case, right?
Then why doesn't that STOP the slowest of oil leaks? What IS
the best valve to use... or should I just tear out the pump
(eventually) and do my best to eliminate end play as the
manual suggests (although seems like that would have been done
many times already through these last decades...)

Come on, guys! I don't want to attend this question tomorrow,
only to see 8 people read the post, but not a single one of
you willing to TRY to help the newest (greenest!) guy out.

  

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NortonGuySat Nov-28-09 02:00 PM
Member since Mar 18th 2009
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#1. "Deleted message"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

No message

NortonGuy
Board Founder

  

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BullSun Nov-29-09 12:19 AM
Member since Sep 03rd 2009
19 posts
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#2. "RE: OIL circulation, oil change, and other questio..."
In response to Reply # 1


          

Are you guys for friggin' REAL?!?!
Twenty-odd owners read my post, and not a one of you on this site changes their own damned OIL?! A "local mechanic", is it? What, the 16 year old 'expert' boy down at 'Speedy Lube'?!

So, like... what year was it that this site died?

I would be FOREVER grateful to any (if!) one of you that could direct me to a 'help forum' website regarding Nortons that actually has some energy to it.

(in case there's any doubt, yeah, I'm dissappointed)

  

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dynodaveMon Nov-30-09 08:04 AM
Member since Mar 18th 2009
706 posts
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#3. "RE: OIL circulation, oil change, and other questio..."
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

In the US we have just had one of our bigger holidays.
You won't see much activity here.

I see you are of the crowd
"I want it all"
"I want it now"
and
"I want it free"

Did you try buying the shop manual or looking it up for FREE on
http://britmoto.com/
http://britmoto.com/manuals/Manuals/Oil_Kit.pdf
http://britmoto.com/manuals/Manuals/Riders_3.pdf

normal oil change is
drain the tank
optional: drain any residue in the engine 9/16 plug(850)
change the filter if present
fill to 1/2 way on dipstick

Big Nut/filter in oil tank is a coarse strainer and is not usually touched.

  

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BullMon Nov-30-09 12:31 PM
Member since Sep 03rd 2009
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#4. "RE: OIL circulation, oil change, and other questio..."
In response to Reply # 3


          

Narcissist? I? Not at all, Dave. True, I, as like everyone who has ever lived, has a pinch of narcissism (anyone who denies, lies), but I don't think so in this case. I restore classic english sports cars. I've thousands of posts through the years, telephone, computer, face-to-face, etc, helping people out. Even over-kill explanations to make sure something is not lost in translation. In this case, I think there WAS something lost... and probably by my writing. Likely due to my being so excited to finally own a Norton. What I wrote was that I have found pieces SCATTERED throughout the manuals (the Haynes and Clymer that I purchased). That is, (inventing here, as I don't recall specifics from memory) chapter 57, section 101, paragraph 3 says 'oh, yeah, ensure you clean out the banjo union located at...

And then, chapter 3, section 11, paragraph 9 says 'oh, yeah, there's a big screen filter behind that big bolt located to the rear of the oil tank. Clean it in parafin, let dry thoroughly, re-install...

And then, chapter 17, section 908, paragraph 2,178,002 says 'oh, yeah, there's a drain plug on the lower left hand side crankcase...

Does this make a little more sense as to where I am coming from? My whole point is that it doesn't seem to be all in one neat, well organized package. I'm finding bits and pieces, scattered 'hither and yon', as it were. As stated, I'm loving the READING of the manuals, just hoped I didn't miss something, as I'd hate to change the oil, find out I'd left 1/2 a liter of fouled oil.

**For example, I have yet to find any mention of how to drain the old oil from the RIGHT side crankcase. OBVIOUSLY, there's some way to do so... eventually I shall find/figure it on my own.

But come on! Twenty five Norton owners come on line, take 5-10 minutes to read the (overly excited, I admit) post (in which I even MENTIONED that I hoped I wouldn't find everyone reading, but no one replying)... and nobody wanting to take the time to say "Hey, kid, glad you're so excited about a Norton, but what exactly are you looking for?" (or some such). 30,000 members? What, and only two (2) of you actually post? (not my intent to sound like I'm ripping the guy who suggested a local mechanic, but there 'AIN'T NO' local Norton mechanic).

I am excited, so WILL apologize for coming across as excited.
And I'll also apologize for coming across sometimes OTHER than how I really mean it. And also for getting to excited to 'write' more clear, terse, concise questions. And also apologize for typing (most probably) TO DAMNED MUCH...

So, that's a lot of apologies to you, and to ALL the 'good' guys who hang here (the both of you, lol's!)

But, please... TWENTY-ODD Norton owners read my question about something as simple and innane as a rediculous oil change... and THEY REFUSE to say JACK... and it be *I* referred (inferred) to as narcissistic?

Umm... me thinks perhaps you're about 25 fingers short to be pointing out the narcissistic lane (that might only make sense if you put yourself in MY shoes, think about it).

One good thing regarding your reply, Dave. Yes, I'm guilty of not 'searching'. Didn't/don't know about it. As such, damned glad you mentioned it. Will now try to figure out how to do so... again, thanks for mentioning it to me, and I've NO finger to be pointing at you, lol's!

  

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BullMon Nov-30-09 12:48 PM
Member since Sep 03rd 2009
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#5. "RE: OIL circulation, oil change, and other questio..."
In response to Reply # 4


          

I followed your supplied liks, and was both amazed and pleased! Took me quite a while to figure out exactly how I was supposed to even know what britmoto WAS... just glad to see it... but I EVENTUALLY noticed that there are links to it (and others) across the header of this page/site. Sorry, I had never noticed them before, in my excitement to find you older 'experts' on the bikes.

So, there's another apology. Still working on your search engine thing...

  

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BullMon Nov-30-09 12:59 PM
Member since Sep 03rd 2009
19 posts
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#6. "RE: OIL circulation, oil change, and other questio..."
In response to Reply # 5


          

Hmmm.. starting to figure out the way to 'search'. However, I cannot get the pages to display. EX: I find old post about 'wet sumping and valve to stop it' (or some such). I'm even pretty sure I know what this post and replies is about... but clicking it only gives me an entire blank page.

QUESTION: surely old archived posts are not deleted?! I assume at this point I'm still doing something wrong, and will return to try again when I have more time.

By the way, Dave... that's a lovely lookin' Norton you have there. I like how you painted the logo on the 'case. Presume you're ok with it if I steal that idea?

  

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dynodaveTue Dec-01-09 11:40 AM
Member since Mar 18th 2009
706 posts
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#7. "RE: OIL circulation, oil change, and other questio..."
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

"**For example, I have yet to find any mention of how to drain the old oil from the RIGHT side crankcase. OBVIOUSLY, there's some way to do so... eventually I shall find/figure it on my own"

If you are refering to the "timing chest"...
The only way is to pull the cover off....it's not normally done.
In reality the oil does slowly drain back to the "crankcase" by passing through the clearance/between the case and the sheet metal oil baffle, leaking through the main bearing.(roller or ball depending on year) then coming to rest in the main sump.

This bit of residual oil some people think is oil pump wet sumping.

Real wet sumping being it's own issue as you will eventually hear about..

  

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BullTue Dec-01-09 03:29 PM
Member since Sep 03rd 2009
19 posts
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#8. "RE: OIL circulation, oil change, and other questio..."
In response to Reply # 7


          

Nope, search engine isn't working for me. As a test, went looking for anything 'wet sump' related, per your last comment (I know I must be close to understanding it, though perhaps inncorrect on 'where' the oil leaks to and pools...).

I chose the following to read as a test (after advance search):

Mark III , wet sump??
Topic started by MichaelB, Feb 09th 2004 (1 replies)
Last modified by dynodave, Feb 09th 2004

(I figure with your name on it, you'll know it's legit).
However, again, there's nothing to read, just a blank page. I do NOT need any help with this, though (don't even need a reply as I'm sure you all are very busy people in your own right). I shall try and figure it out on my own as, quite frankly, I was (and am!) used to doing before deciding to search for quality expertise on-line.

And, too, Mr. NortonGuy: on the off chance you didn't catch it in my long-winded reply (#4 above, I believe)... please know that I did (most definately) NOT intend any direct slight towards YOU... but, rather, a verbalized contempt for the 20-odd Norton owners who would take time to read the 'newbies' plea for a little information... and then be so greedy and rude as to not bother throwing me even yesterdays' old bone. So, having re-read my post, I can see where you might think I was heckling you. Nothing further from the truth.

But those other 20-odd Norton owners who refused to share? KMA.
Again, no replies needed. Honest, I'll manage.

  

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NortonGuyFri Dec-25-09 08:26 PM
Member since Mar 18th 2009
143 posts
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#9. "Hello"
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

Norton friend,
As the founder of this web site I can assure you no one was ignoring you.

You are quite wordy but I understand you are just trying to get in all the details. Most of the guys on the board have day jobs and a life so it is sometimes a week or two before someone that can help has time to answer your long post.

I apologize for the links and page layout. I am trying to get around to a few changes but I bought my own car lift this year and it has got me on some car projects. I had rather be wrenching since I have my 78 Dodge pickup about 80% restored with rebuilt engine and tranny. But I will be back on the site making changes soon.

A new Norton project gets me fird up too. I hope to get one going soon.

cheers from nortonguy,
steve

NortonGuy
Board Founder

  

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NortonGuyTue Nov-05-13 07:18 AM
Member since Mar 18th 2009
143 posts
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#10. "RE: Hello"
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

Three dodge pickups later I finally got around to updating the board software to 2013 standards. It is much faster and all options, including search, are working.

Off the Norton subject the pickups included one slant six engine. For those who do not know about this engine google it. It has a lot of torque and gets 25-30 mpg. A real work horse. 1978 era.

Back to business. Oil change is one of our hottest topics and this thread, ever how log and sometimes off topic, covers it all.

NortonGuy
Board Founder

  

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Norton Commando Oil Change